i guess this is an advertisement not to use drugs.. http://news4colorado.com/water/watercooler_story_195185728.html.
http://news4colorado.comman cuts off, eats own penisjul 14, 2003 4:57 pm us/mountain.
police in malaysia say a man cut off his own penis and then fried and ate it.
Our local paper a couple of months ago had a story about the police being called to a disturbance at a house and when they got there they found a woman with ALL her teeth pulled out by her boyfriend.
She didn't press charges though because they had both been so high on drugs. She'd heard voices telling her the teeth were possessed and got her boyfriend to pull them out.
So I'm not that surprised at this story.
nabonidus -- 17 years.
nebuchadnezzar -- 43 years.
nabonidus -- 17 years
J Canon
On the Biblical front though, the 511BCE dating is the same as the Bible's. The Bible chronology rests on 29CE when Christ got baptized. No one objects to that date, the 15th of Tiberius. 483 years earlier was the "word going forth to rebuild Jerusalem" which was the 1st of Cyrus, which is dated to 455BCE. You add 70 years of exile to that to the time of the last deportation, per Josephus and the Bible, to arrive at 525BCE for the 23rd year of Nebuchadnezzar. From this point, you can then date all the events well-documented in the reign of Nebuchadnezzar. Of course, year 37 falls in 511BCE---big surprise; it was the original dating, now proven by the VAT4956.
Thus all discussions that don't deal with the VAT4956 reference to 511BCE as the original date for year 37 of Nebuchadnezzar are outdated discussions and mean nothing but error and fantasy.
You're not just going against Babylonian chronology here but also against Egyptian chronology. If you pick 511 BC not 568 as Nebuchadnezzar's 37th year then you would also have to date the battle of Carchemish as 548 BCE. Countless Egyptian inscriptions and documents have been found containing information about the Egyptian calendar, astronomical events and lengths of the Pharoah's reigns. Researchers also use dendrochronology and C14 dating techniques to date the Egyptian dynasties.
Pharoah Necho of the Saite dynasty ruled from 610 to 595 BCE. This would date the battle of Carchemish to 605 BCE and Nebuchadnezzar's 37th year as 568 BCE.
i am not writing these quetions to offend anyone, i am just seeking honest answers.
will you jehovah's witnesses help me in finding answers?
there is only 1 god.
Don't you just love those [other] added words.
nabonidus -- 17 years.
nebuchadnezzar -- 43 years.
nabonidus -- 17 years
Those were excellent posts Alleymom.
I've been looking for a way to disprove 607 with their own literature. I know where I can get a 1965 bound volume and I'm going to do a simple chart as you have done using the 1965 Watchtower.
They are on record as having given the lengths of reign of each king, and they are on record as having said so-and-so succeeded so-and-so
Perfect.
nabonidus -- 17 years.
nebuchadnezzar -- 43 years.
nabonidus -- 17 years
Scholar
what date marked the Fall of Ferusalem, 586 OR 587?
You've been shown time and time again why this is a non-argument. As a scholar this should be simple to understand. Why do you persist with this rubbish. Who are you trying to convince, us or yourself?
this is my first post.. when i was still a witness myself, there were some perennial stories regarding 'famous' jehovahs witnesses or ex's.
does anyone know any truth or have any proof about the following: hank marvin, cliff richard and more importantly, the man who hit the gong in the 'rank' movies?.
if you have anyone of note you want to tell me about, i'd most appreciate it too.. cheers, rush.
Glitter - you're joking aren't you? Tony Adams! Next you'll be telling me Vinnie Jones is studying.
Bolton Wanderers ex-footballer Eric Bell is a JW. He either scored or broke his leg (or both) in the Cup Final. Wayne Sleep was brought up a witness! So was Ginger Spice.
i am not writing these quetions to offend anyone, i am just seeking honest answers.
will you jehovah's witnesses help me in finding answers?
there is only 1 god.
Neonmadman -
Sorry I usually say which translation I quote from. The quote was from the Revised Standard Version. This translation uses the older Septaguint text which also agrees with the Dead Sea Scrolls and the phrase can be translated 'sons of God' or 'divine sons'.
It is true that most bible translations use the Masoretic text as a starting point but the discovery of the dead sea scrolls showed that the older Septaguint was the more accurate text. You will usually find a footnote at Deut 32:8-9 in a modern translation to say this if it doesn't already translate the phrase as 'sons of God'.
the Zondervan NIV Exhaustive Concordance lists the root word in verse 8 as yisra'el.
That's the root word in the Masoretic text.
The people's of the ancient middle east around the area of Ugarit thought of the divine council as the Most High God El presiding over his sons, each of whom was the patron deity of a nation. In the earliest traditions Yahweh was one of these divine sons of El and this is the idea behind the Septaguint and Dead Sea Scrolls reading of Deut 32. Later when the Talmudic Jews created the Masoretic text they were uncomfortable with the polytheism in the phrase 'according to the number of the divine sons' and changed it to read 'sons of Israel'.
Psalms 82 also describes the old view of the divine council whilst also denouncing it.
It seems clear to me that these are human judges and rulers
Then why does the psalm say "you shall die like men" if the beings spoken to were men?
God refers to them sarcastically as "gods"
Prove it!
For this psalm to carry the interpretation you suggest would place it at odds with the rest of the Bible
Most of it, yes. My 'agenda' as you put it is to find out why and how the bible came to us in its present form. It is mainly monotheistic because the Deutoronomic and post exilic bible editors made it that way. But there are enough clues in archaeology, contemporary Ugaritic documents and verses such as those discussed that prove Israel was largely polytheistic and slowly developed monotheism.
Doesn't it make more sense to understand the religion of the Hebrews consistently?
Yes it does. And it also makes more sense when you fully understand the background of how the religion of the Hebrews developed from myths, other religions, historical and political events.
Again, taking Deuteronomy 32:8,9 in context, we find a description of God's deliverance of Israel from Egypt. He 'divided mankind' and 'set boundaries for the people' in the sense of making a place for His people among the other nations. The other nations had to yield their place in favor of Israel, because the Israelites were God's favored people.
Well that's the way the Talmudic writers of the Masoretic text wanted it understood. But the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Septaguint show otherwise. The nations were divided among El's divine sons and Israel was Yahweh's portion.
ok has anyone heard or watched the new cartoon with pam anderson called "stripperella"?
this cartoon witch pam anderson does the voice over is supposed to be a stripper at night and later that night she fights crime and is some kind of superhero.
lol she gave a small interview about the show and said that the only thing she wanted was to make sure the cartoon didn't show her boobs....what the hell was stan lee thinking?
Hey - I like Sponge Bob Square Pants!!!
i am not writing these quetions to offend anyone, i am just seeking honest answers.
will you jehovah's witnesses help me in finding answers?
there is only 1 god.
If you read the entire psalm in context, however, you find that the "gods" among whom God is judging are actually mere men
The context shows the opposite, that they are lesser gods, sons of the Most High Elyon.
Psalms 82 says:
0: A Psalm of Asaph.
1: God has taken his place in the divine council; in the midst of the gods he holds judgment:
2: "How long will you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? [Selah]
3: Give justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute.
4: Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked."
5: They have neither knowledge nor understanding, they walk about in darkness; all the foundations of the earth are shaken.
6: I say, "You are gods, sons of the Most High, all of you;
7: nevertheless, you shall die like men, and fall like any prince."
8: Arise, O God, judge the earth; for to thee belong all the nations!
God here is El. He takes his place in the divine council to judge the gods of the nations. He decides that they will become mortal and die like men. Why? Because ‘to thee (El) belong all the nations.
This verse is an Elohist passage from the northern Israelite tribes. El was viewed as the supreme God and Most High or El Elyon. He gave the nations to his sons as an inheritance so that each nation had its own god,
This can be seen from an old passage in Deutoronomy 32:8,9:
8: When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of men, he fixed the bounds of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God.
9: For the LORD's (Yahweh’s) portion is his people, Jacob his allotted heritage.
It is interesting to note that for centuries verse 8 was translated as ‘according to the number of the children of ’ not ‘according to the number of the sons of God’ (see King James version). Later bible redactors of the Masoretic text changed this passage to read ‘children of ’ simply because of the polytheistic nature of the verse. A comparison of the older Greek Septaguint with the Dead Sea Scrolls shows how corrupted some of the passages in the Masoretic text had become. The Septaguint and the Dead Sea Scrolls correctly translate this text as ‘the number of the sons of God’.
So the original text of Deut 32:8,9 shows that El was the Most High God and Yahweh was ‘a god’ in a pantheon of gods who was given the people of Israel as his inheritance. In fact Psalms 89 verse 7 calls Yahweh ‘a God feared in the council of the holy ones, great and terrible above all that are round about him’.
Of course in time Yahweh merged with El as the Most High God ‘Yahweh Elohim’. In the bible there are many 'gods' but only one 'Most High' God. The bible sometimes has trouble identifying who this Most High God is.
please, y'all out there..congratulate dansk on becoming a jedi master.. since we've been out (feb 03) this board and all you lovely people on it have been the greatest source of inspiration to both dansk and myself.
you'll never realise how much you have helped us to cope with the whole ordeal.
so reaching his jedi status is a real milestone.. you're all life-savers and you didn't even know it!!!.
You're right Dansk - we'll have to meet up. Maybe this could involve footie, the pub, or both!
